anti fascist

Comment

Comment by Ezekielpoop on December 3, 2009 at 3:13pm

whoa. those are some long comments..

the only sharps that i've ever met were all assholes who always were trying to start shit.
I wish i was my age now in the late seventies, early eighties. That's when everyone gave a damn, and stood up for themselves and what they believe in. Nowadays, every one jus kicks back and says, fucket. I can't do anything about it. who cares.
It's fuckin disgusting.

Comment by H on November 24, 2009 at 7:27am

Hmm...to be honest i think if people think it's cool to show off an anti-nazi sign thats a good thing. It's a bit like my 'fight fascism with food!' argument, at least it's a start & they'll be around other anti-nazi people. I also think it's good that you've set up this anti-fascist group - the more the merrier!

That's a very unfortunate misunderstanding about the sharp skins gig & one i've never heard of happening here thank god. I still can't help but think good on 'em for being so ready to fight the nazi's off!

As for the befriending/winning over, what i said was a joke. Thinking about it though, i do think you can have an impact on people with rascist, sexist, homophobic etc..ideas (depending how severe) for the better. So many people are uneducated and haven't ever had a chance to be around someone left wing. I also think we all have our own prejudices to a certain extent that we need challenging. I know i have had some impact through conversations, knowing and even going out with some people with screwed up ideas. I'll give a just a couple of examples, 1 new and 1 old.
When i was 15 i went out with a boy who thought asylum seekers were 'ruining' our country and all that crap. Of course i challenged him a lot and being 15 it didn't last long. Then a few years later when i was 18 i got a letter from him saying that after knowing me it inspired him to not only change his opinions but he went on to join a defend asylum seekers campaign. I don't have the paitence or want to go out with someone like that now, but at least it wasn't in vein.

The recent example was earlier this year when i went to a job fair with a group of students i was doing a course with. We were confronted by an RAF man recruiting for the army, so i was sraight in there. I was charming and polite but incredibly direct with the truth about our illegal war & to my suprise he admitted a lot of things i never expected & he just couldn't answer a lot of things. Instead of getting defensive he couldn't stop smiling and kept saying he'd never met anyone like me and that he was never going to forget me. I'm sure he didn't leave the army the next day, but you never know!. I've met many ex service men who have left and turned anti-war.
However it is draining and hard so it's just impossible (for me anyway) to be like that all of the time. Also i think there is a HUGE difference between people having fucked up ideas/prejudices, and NAZI'S. Anyone who states themselves as a NAZI is openly stating complete intolerance, with the intent to ERADICATE through MURDER ANYONE who is different, disabled, gay, a different race &/or religion, trade unionists, gypsies, peace activists and pretty much anyone who diagrees with them. ALL these categories of people (millions not thousands) were slaughterd by nazi's in the second world war, not just Jews.

If you are a nazi you CAN NOT DISASSOCIATE yourself with this fact and wear swastikas, which were the SYMBOL of that genocide and idiology, otherwise YOU'RE NOT actually a nazi!
I HAVE NO TIME FOR NAZI'S.
& it's incredably dangerous to let them on this site.

Comment by rotten_beer on November 21, 2009 at 3:33pm

i know, they just add the group to their profile to show off the anti-nazi sign.
allthough i started the anti-fascist group because there are a lot of misunderstandings in the anti-nazi group. skinheads were mentioned somewhere, traditional skins aren't nazi, people should be educated about this too.
one time, some skins(not rascist) has a concert(gathering in the city, and some foreigners had heard about this so they came running and beat the shit out of the poor bastards on the concert because they thought they were nazi.

i don't know about the winning over, i always think "once a rascist, always a rascist" i know it's stupid, but its even more stupid to actually become a rascist or nazi in the first place.

that was really clever though, people should organise things like that more often. and you're right about the food, it's the easiest way to get people to come to meetings:) not everyone is political enough to know how to discuss rascism in politics etc, so having a meeting just for the sake of talking would get boring for them in the long run.

it's great you got the council to do that, it's important not to let rascists be a part of anything, really. society.

no, hippy-punks are pascifist punks. and you're aboslutley right, but unfortunately there arent many heads like yours out there. i've noticed most punks here where i live are too busy sticking out of the crowd to get more people involed. punk has become a trend, and they only keep to themselves.

yeah, it was really scary. they're not allowed to put propaganda on commercials on tv here, so they travel around from school to school and have debates. i can't believe they even let the rascist parties in, neither that none of the other political parties didn't boycott the school debates! i think they should ban nazi organisations, i know we have "freedom of speech", but this is sick.

but great ideas anyways, i'll mention it to the others next time we have a meeting!

Comment by H on November 21, 2009 at 1:37pm

I gatherd the punks are getting less political! i can't believe i'm the only peron who has answered the anti police discussions which started months ago-and this group has only got 3 members. I mean what the fuck? I'm not evan a punk i was staight on it. saying that i was really pleased to see the anti-nazi group has the biggest membership of all the groups. Things like that restore some faith. can kinda understand people who aren't claiming to be punks (although really i think they have just as much duty to be anti-fascist as any one else) just talking bout hair&music but i thought 1 of the fundamentals of being a punk is to be anti fascist and the police who protect them. Any punk who thinks it's ok to be friends with a nazi is a fucking disgrace to themselves and others. That is fucked up shit. The only excuse for that would be if they were infaltraiting their group! Or possibly trying to win them over? Bearing in mind a lot of the young boys are just that young boys and very ignorant, but that would be one painfully long and most probably time waisting way of fighting fascism i've heard of. Or mabie not!? Mabie thats it, we should all befriend them and show them how fucking wonderful it is being free from constant hate for the wrong things and what good fucks we are when you don't hold back on trying a bit of everything, they just need a bit of black cock bless 'em-Ha Ha. Anywho I don't know what that has to do with being a hippy though? Ive never met a hippy who thought it was ok be friends with a nazi. Quite a lot of them are pascifists which is very anoying but then most of the bloody punks are too. Don't think that has anything to do with pot either. Do you mean pop/fashion/mainstream punks when you talk of these hippy punks? How are people in general being more passive irelevent? It's totally relevant. Do you think it's only going to be a reletivly small group(by world standards) of punks that are going to defeat fascism? Really scary to hear that they nearly got in power where you are 2-boooooo!. Punks got no need or right to be snobby, that again contradicts the fundamentals, their assholes just as much as the rest of us. Back to what to do, i thing 1 think we should start doing (if you already have an established movement?)is using the tactics of buisness sense to our own advantage, by this i DONT MEAN making money. What i mean is successful buisness people(well some) will study human behaviour to see what makes them enjoy meetings,shops and things like that so they want to go back and they can get the best out of the workers or customers to get the most money out of them. We need to apply this to OUR meetings and events not to make money but to encourage people to come back and to WANT to be an activist. I know it sounds simple but just liitle things like having refreshments and a nice(not perfect) but just slightly lighter atmosphere. Our meetings always tend to be on a week day in the eve at around 7&last atleat 1 if not a couple of hours, i think should be 1hr max otherwise people switch off. This is also when people are tired and hungry after a long day of doing whatever(evan if they havn't done much) i'm not saying put on a three course menu, just a bloody cup of tea, a buiscuit, crist all mighty mabi evan stretch to the odd roll! It would make it more bareable. So many other events have found that when people have these basics it makes all the difference. When i suggested this at one meeting(which consists of the same 4/5 people-that tells you something) they reacted like i suggested having a wanking session together! I offerd to be th 1 to make the stuff en'all. I've given up on them now. I decided to have a meeting at my house instead and when inviting people (all people-thats anoyher thing don't discriminate who you ask,you'd be amazed at how often its the liltle old lady or some random ordinary lookind man that will come and turn into a radical if there not already 1 more than the boy dressed as a "punk") the second i mentioned food they soon perked up. The meeting was packed and a success as far as making new links to communities like the somali and turkish which are huge around my area and starting a new campaign where we forced our local council to sign an act to bann Nazis from being involved in community led projects, small but a start and a victory none the less. I think that proves(in my little case anyway) people didn't come just for the food it just encouraged them to come and be comfortable and enjoy the experiance, thus getting the best out of them, evan if 1 or 2 do just come for that its worth it for what you gain(their in your grasp for a start). If your trying to encourage other races and culters which is a must in the movement i think this is particually important because so much of the cultures i've learnt about centre around food. Please don't think i'm saying the whole greater fight against fascism is about some sandwiches-ha ha, this is just 1 LITTLE example of MANY MANY ideas i have and have experianced which i'm going to share with you all. I want to hear other peoples ideas and experiances to learn what does and doesnt work.
Love to you all
Hannah grace

Comment by rotten_beer on November 21, 2009 at 4:45am

I think the the punk "scene"(mwaha) in general is getting less political. that's a big problem. of course people in general are getting more passive too, but thats not relevant. anyway, punks today are snobby. they dont like mainstream people because most of them are assholes. but on the other hand there are of course many non-assholes too, but still.

i know many punks who think its okay to have nazi or rascist friends (this is what i was trying to say in the hippy hater's thread) they're pascifists pot heads the whole lot. hippy punks everywhere! its disgusting

we already have five rascist/nazi political parties, one of them nearly won the election this year, and no one's doing anything
i know how you feel, this is really not good. i don't know what to do either.

Comment by H on November 20, 2009 at 9:22pm

I've been fighting fascism in all its many forms all my life it seems, right back to the poll tax riots (was still in a pushchair&actually remember it!) to the huge hope building riots in Genoa Italy when i was sixteen and recently the anti bnp campaigns London and many inbetween. I've been really down bout the struggle recently, my hope has fizzled from a rock to a grain of sand. I honestly never thought(call me neive) in my lifetime the bnp would actually get into mainstreem power. I'm heartbroken. Evan though i know thier not my enemy, i can't help feeling a bit bitter towards the antifascist activists themselves. It just seems that so many of them are snoby and sectarian putting soooo many people especially mainstreem working class and black people off. The only way were going to beat fasism is through mass action with the mass of people which we have to accept are going to be pop loving, ex factor watching, gold wearing, sun reading, supermarket shopping,God worshiping, insecure, full of uneven conciosness fuck ups.(fuck,looking at that list i'm actually most of that accept the sun reading, i do draw the line at) We need them! We need to get them on OUR side. It amazes me when i've been to various activists activities/meetings/demo's how white they are. In London one the most multi race/culterd cities on Earth that is just NOT acceptable and we have to start looking at why? How can we get more people involved? But everytime i talk about these issues people just get defensive and make uot it's counter productive to critisise or don't evan accept it's happening! I promice i'm not just "slagging off" for the sake of it, i just thinks somethings seriosly not right/working with our movement so the only way we can change it is to be honest about y its not working and do somethink the fuck about it so we can MOVE ON. If we don't i really fear (which i never thought i'd be saying) that the nazi's/facists will completely take controll and humanity will be fucked. AHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! Any ideas/inspiration? I have lots, will hopefully tell all in future seeing as this is already going on a bit. By the way the litte story i wrote the other day to caption my fairie photos are the beginings of a fantasy story i'm going to write about this subject and yes it will have a happy ending if it can't evan be one in a fantasy then i'll chuck myself off the bridge now. Check it out.
Hannah Grace

Comment by rotten_beer on November 13, 2009 at 4:10pm

welcome, welcome
nice to see there are more than one anti fascist here.